- A FERTILIZED HUMAN EGG IS NOT A PERSON----ANY MORE THAN AN ACORN IS AN OAK TREE.
- BOTH ACORN AND EGG -- TAPER GRADUALLY INTO SIGNIFICANCE.
- UNTIL THEY HAVE REACHED THE POINT OF SIGNIFICANCE IT IS BOTH LEGAL AND MORAL TO DESTROY THEM. THEY ARE WITHIN THE LIMITS OF EXPENDABILITY.
- THERE ARE GOOD REASONS TO DESTROY BOTH. UNWANTED BABIES ARE A CURSE ON THE WORLD; AND IT IS IRRATIONAL TO TRY TO PRESERVE EVERY ACORN.
- THE SUPREME COURT HAS DECIDED THAT 22 WEEKS SHALL BE THE LIMIT OF EXPENDABILITY FOR FERTILIZED HUMAN EGGS. (In most cases)(Roe v Wade etc) Beyond these limits we forbid the killing of fetuses because it offends our collective sensibilities.
- MANY CITIES HAVE DECIDED THAT 3 INCHES IN DIAMETER SHALL BE THE LIMIT OF EXPENDABILITY FOR OAK TREES. (destroying any larger oak tree requires a permit)
- 22 WEEKS FOR ZYGOTES AND 3 INCHES FOR OAK TREES MAY SEEM TO BE (and indeed are somewhat) ARBITRARY NUMBERS(could have been 21 weeks or 3 and a half inches) BUT THEY ARE BOTH REASONABLE GUESSES AND HAVE BEEN SET BY DEMOCRATIC PROCESS.
- IT WAS DIFFICULT , CONTROVERSIAL AND COURAGEOUS TO DRAW THESE SOMEWHAT ARBITRARY LINES BUT THEY ARE ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY FOR A FUNCTIONING SOCIETY.
- BECAUSE---IF YOU DO NOT LIKE SOMEWHAT ARBITRARY LINES---(reasonable guesses)-THEN YOU DO NOT LIKE CIVILIZATION---FOR (somewhat) ARBITRARY LINES ARE LARGELY WHAT DEFINES A CIVILIZATION:(speed limits, voting age, marriagable age, alcohol consumption, election elgibility)(indeed our constitution itself is mostly a long list of (somewhat)ARBITRARY limits)
- We could (and may) move the limits slightly, more or less, for both. But WE CANNOT MOVE THE LIMIT BACK TO ZERO AS THE REPUBLICANS ADVOCATE WITHOUT IMPOSING GREAT CRUELTY ON WOMEN FORCING THEM TO BEAR CHILDREN THEY DO NOT WANT.
- IT IS FANATICAL TO BELIEVE THAT A FERTILIZED EGG---BARELY VISIBLE TO THE EYE-- IS AS IMPORTANT AS ---SAY--A 3 YEAR OLD CHILD. ( prove it to yourself: imagine a fertility clinic is on fire and you only have time to save the 3 year old or 10 fertilized eggs in a pitri dish. Which would you save? )
- REPUBLICANS I KNOW DO NOT WANT TO BE CLASSED WITH FANATICS--AND YET THEY HAVE MADE COMMON CAUSE WITH RELIGIOUS FANATICS TO GET THEIR VOTES.
- TO AVOID THE HORRORS OF AN OVERPOPULATED WORLD WE MUST CHANGE THEIR MINDS ALONG WITH THE MINDS OF MUSLIMS, MORMONS, CATHOLICS AND FUNDAMENTALIST CHRISTIANS AND JEWS--ABOUT ABORTION. IT MUST REMAIN SAFE, LEGAL---AND HOPEFULLY RARE.
.
It's about control.
ReplyDeleteI think Republicans should be forced to adopt and raise each unwanted baby that could be born if this backwards way of thinking should ever to come to fruition. Its so funny the GUN toting Right who want everyone armed and ready to kill would see abortion as wrong but murdering an unarmed kid wearing a hoodie is perfectly acceptable! Maybe if we shot the zygote it would be okay by them?
ReplyDeleteWell said, Randy. Thank you.
ReplyDeleteI too agree with this rant. The Republicans have really gone off the deep end. 90% of abortions occur within the first 12 weeks of pregnancy. Any talk of "babies" at that stage is criminally insane. Half of all pregnancies in the USA are unplanned and 40% of the unplanned ones are terminated through abortion. The elimination of this human right would restore the dark ages of women dying from illegal back alley abortions. I don't understand how any woman can even think of voting Republican. I am visiting my retired dad who is glued to Fox News. The steady drumbeat of anti-abortion and other right-wing propaganda there just turns my stomach. Let's give these right-wingers a real whuppin in the next presidential election. Do van nomads vote?
ReplyDeleteThen there are those who get as fanatical about sperm and unfertilized eggs.
ReplyDeletei am in total agreement with you. i am sick of the rants against abortion. it is the choice of the pregnant woman- ONLY! it disgusts me and i will not submit to having another's religious beliefs legislated and forced upon me. a 10 year old in paraguay was forced to have a baby conceived when her step father raped her. that is frigging digusting! mccaine wants to make abortion illegal for all, including rape and incest victims. how dare he and the others?
ReplyDeleteVery logical, reasonable argument, i have to agree. Except the religious fanatics think with their hearts, without any consideration of the consequences. Perhaps those who are forced to have babies should give them to the pro-lifers to raise!
ReplyDeleteRandy what you say is true. It should only be the woman's choice.
ReplyDeleteHowever its not just republicans, I know plenty of democrats that
think abortion is wrong.
==========
ReplyDeleteGreat rant but I find it curious the Catholics are conspicuously absent from your list. Not only do they have a dog in this fight, they created the whole asinine fight to begin with! It's my understanding it was *their* revelation from God (in other words, a fresh, stinky, steaming pile of BS) which decided the soul entered the body at conception -- instead of at birth as was previously "believed" to be the case.
==========
It should be abundantly clear that NONE of these religions give a flying spit whether bodies live or die but they're in a clear competition for souls. How perfectly in keeping with their elusive MO to focus on that which can't be seen, quantified, or verified.
==========
sail4free (aka JIM & ANNIE -- 9 weeks & 5 days to go!)
==========
Seriously. If the right is so adamant about making sure all pregnancies go through, where are all the right wing orphanages or assistance programs...?
ReplyDeleteBunch of mindless hypocrites...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteA mighty oak from a tiny acorn grows.
ReplyDeleteOne acorn can become one oak tree.
Sperm and egg.
A sperm or egg can not alone become a person.
Two different once together become one.
What kind of fuzzy math is that, huh?
Judge this: "Safe, Legal and Rare?"
A birth mother cast off, I was adopted at a few days age.
I was wanted, loved, and ALWAYS knew it!
What if she had decided "Safe, Legal, and Rare" 7 1/2 to nine months earlier?
Who among us is sufficient to decide these matters?
Which would you choose and under what conditions?
Why would one circumstance have merit and another lack?
Who sets the qualifications and enforces them?
What would be done about violations and violators?
What if the subject were puppies, dolphins, or whales?
If posted on animal websites, what would the responses be like?
Agreed. Thank you for this post.
ReplyDeleteWOW! I mean just WOW!!!
ReplyDeleteAll that moral clarity with the added bonus of a tidy little profit on selling the spare parts.
Genius!
Killing babies is at least the most selfish thing people can do.
ReplyDeleteRandy, Randy, Randy...
ReplyDeleteGetting all bent out of shape over something which you have no control serves no useful purpose. Have you not learned anything from our years of friendship? :)
A human fertilized egg or ZYGOTE (see definition below) is in the first stage of being a person/human. Whether at this initial stage or 99 year old human it is only a matter of life cycle. If terminated for any reason at any time you have killed life. An Acorn used in this explanation is not a Zygote as it is not fertilized yet. This acorn may have potential to be a tree, but will not become a tree as is. Their fore is just an enatimate object on the ground. A Fertilized Human egg can't be compared to an enatimate object morally or other wise. Their fore I disagree with the very premise that they are equal or equivalent.
ReplyDeletezygote | cell | Britannica.com
www.britannica.com/science/zygote
Dec 23, 2014 - The zygote represents the first stage in the development of a genetically unique organism. The zygote is endowed with genes from two parents, ...
Mothers not wanting their babies does not make babies a curse on the world, only inconvenient. Many people would love to adopt babies and raise them with the respect and love they deserve.
Arbitrary guidelines (regulations) set up by the Government for such things like speed limits, voting age etc may be fine but have nothing to do with terminating life in any form and is again not comparable.
For those supporting Abortion you may like this piece. I don't believe the Government has the insight, knowledge or authority for any such decision that is this morally subjective. Nor shall the Govt. be involved with any subjective decision on people as long as they are consenting adults. For example, if gay people have sexual relations behind close doors, it is not my business, again between consenting adult. If I disagree that is my propagative or right, but I don't have the right to impose my views as I am not involved. On the other hand, if you and me my opinion no one has the right to be offended and impose their view on me, it is to subjective. Don't look for the Govt. look to yourself and live with the consequences of your actions if their is any. Their fore don't ask me to pay for an abortion I disagree with. And if you don't want to hear what I think of gay relationships don't ask. Everyone is offended but BFD. We all have the right to be free with minimal Govt. intervention.
In my example no one is telling a women what to do with a unwanted pregnancy, it is their propagative. I would suggest that abortion is not a form of contraceptive. Common sense has many alternatives to not be pregnant.
A person that believes in any religion is not a fanatic just because they disagree with anyone's point of view. To say that is political correctness run amuck for personal gain. Leave each other alone and don't impose your subjective opinions as the only correct position. Your are free, treat each other with respect and minimize the Govt. intervention. You and I don't need that if we are civil and of right mind (not mentally ill).
Changing the minds of other people by Govt. decree is communism, no thanks. Changing the ideas of any religion is naive but you can try. For example changing the mind of a Muslim on abortion is a mute point as they will chop your head off unless you are a Muslim.
I am a conservative, not a republican nor registered as such. Most people that support Abortion have a liberal, not democratic, view point. Neither is a fanatic, or should impose their view point on anyone else. Discuss and debate is to be encouraged. Be private on subjective and moral viewpoints. Live and let live.
In conclusion I disagree with the moral equivalents, analogies and comparisons to the
offered article, but appreciate the offer to respond. I think discussion of disagreement is a heathy part of freedom. I would ask that any rebuttal leave the personal slander out of it and only discuss solutions as I hope I tried to do.
Bob: Thanks for writing---and you may be a nice guy and even mean well--but you are so terribly mistaken--and your views when multiplied by a few million--result in oppressive laws that force women to bear children they do not want. Some of your persuasion go further and want the government to forbid birth control. I wonder how crowded the world would have to become before practical realities would trump your religious beliefs. You may or may not know that God is the biggest abortionist because about 40% of pregnancies naturally abort.
ReplyDeleteAnd of course you are wrong about acorns--they are fertilized and will become oaks as is. Here is proof: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS2toXyZAy0 -- time lapse photos of an acorn becoming an oak
I notice you will not face the challenge of a fire in a fertility clinic. Which would you save?
You are on the wrong side of history and decency. The suffering you and your kind impose on the world is immeasurable.
I appreciate your opinion. Beyond the fact that over population is a major problem in that more people are a tax on the planets already dwindling resources, children born to poverty tend to live their entire lives in poverty. Conservatives wish to save the unborn but once they are born if help is needed for food, shelter, clothing, medical, or education these people who were considered a sacred gift from god that had to be protected are belittled, called leaches on society and often left to fend for themselves thanks to the very same conservatives cutting back on social welfare programs. We should further consider that abortion and birth control are frowned upon by conservatives because they wish to control the moral decisions that people make, I feel they want for the to be a punishment for people to have sexual intercourse for any reason other than procreation and that they also want to impose their religious beliefs on everyone, especially women who should be subservient to their husbands and have committed a sin if they have conceived a child out of wedlock.
ReplyDeleteThank you for posting an opinion on your blog that could possibly cost you several readers. You have gained at least one in me.
I respect your opinion. I'm of the opinion that other than in a rape you have a choice to not get pregnant.If you do you are irresponsible!
ReplyDeleteKarel: The punishment you are recommending for a "passionate" mistake is fanatically disproportionate to the "mistake". Forcing a woman to carry a fetus to term then go through childbirth to impose on an overpopulated world one more person.
ReplyDelete